193: Life Hacks To Overcome Conflict In Your Family and In Your Workplace With Dr. Jerry Fu

We have a great leader and coach with us today.

His name is Dr. Jerry Fu from adaptingleaders.com.

He is a conflict resolution coach, which helps people

with to deal with conflicts in the workplace, and in

their personal life with a special emphasis upon

Asian American leaders. Dr. Jerry Fu, welcome to Beyond Adversity.

Hi, Dr. Brad.

Awesome. So glad to have you with me today, Jerry.

You got really an interesting take an interesting

story to tell about your life. You come from an

Asian American background, and that really is

reflected in your story, especially at some of the

conflicts that you had resolved in your life.

When it comes to conflict resolution, coach in

your own right. Tell us a little bit about your

story. What led you to this line of work?

Yeah, absolutely. Um, yeah. So my parents

came over to the US from Taiwan for grad

school, and decided to chart their own course

coming here. I grew up with a healthcare

background. My grandpa was practicing in

Taiwan as a physician for over 50 years and

then uncles in health care. I grew up with two

cousins nearby, who both went to Harvard and

went to med schools. So well, you know, the bar

was set pretty high for that. So between the career

path in health care, which is kind of lined up for

me, along with just being very conflict averse,

and my family was just trying to mind their

own business, right? They're trying to create

a better life for themselves here. And despite

whatever racism or discrimination or unfair

circumstances, right, they just said, Hey, well,

you know, it's just not worth it, to fight them

back, we're just going to keep doing our best

to build our own lives within our own means.

And so, I grew up in a in a conflict averse home.

You know, my parents were always very gracious

hosts, whenever guests came over in any frustrations,

they had guests who were rude or inappropriate

that was just handled in house, they never would

have known better. And so this was what I saw

as model for me is how to deal with conflict, right?

You resent them for not meeting your standard,

even though you've never communicated that

standard to them. And then, you know, you just h

ope that you get over it, you know, with enough

time, and so it doesn't make for a good formula,

but you don't realize that until it's too late. All

right. And so, I grew up with this idea in mind.

And so you know, I managed to go honor my

parents desires for me to work hard and get

good grades and get into a good school. And

all of this was very short sighted for me,

because this is the immigrant's vision for

how to really establish yourself, right, get

good grades, get a profitable skill set,

where it doesn't matter what skin color

you are, people have to call you, doctor, right?

That's credibility and money that they need.

And so the idea is that somehow this is enough, right?

Hey, you know, get the job, get the credibility, get

the money, get married, pass along your family

name, this is the definition of success we want

you to follow. And so my attempts to fulfill this

plan took a hard right in college when I got to

see inorganic chemistry.

That became a big deal, apparently, right?

Oh, yeah. I didn't know what to do with myself, right?

Because I, you know, I graduated top 10 in my high

school, and so I wasn't used to failure. And the few

failures that I did experience, like, he just felt so

embarrassed about him and just said, okay,

let this happen again. It wasn't failure, it wasn't

framed as an opportunity to learn and really

grow and improve in a way that you would

want to yourself. Rather, it was just something

as seen as a sign of incompetence, and just

brought embarrassment, right on your name

and your reputation and the family's name.

And so you had to pick a path that almost

would avoid this kind of embarrassment.

So for me getting waitlisted rejected from

med school, after all the expectations I

said, coming out of high school seemed

insurmountable to me, right? When you

don't know any better, you're just afraid

of embarrassment and shame. And so I

said, well, I need to pivot. I want to do

something in healthcare, but what else

is available to me? And so I said, Well,

pharmacy seems pretty reasonable. Let

me pursue a degree in pharmacy and a

career in pharmacy. And so I convinced

pharmacy school that I would make a

good pharmacist. And next thing you know,

I am starting my pharmacy school journey.

I get through that without a lot of hitches, thankfully.

But, you know, I came to another crossroads

when I was about to graduate because my

mom was very particular about me working

for a company that she really liked. Even

though she'd never worked a day in her life

in pharmacy. See Moms always know best, right?

Of course, of course.

So you know, this on top of the fact that I was

very now is even more conflict averse than ever,

because I just wasn't in the mood to deal with it

at all. Every time someone leaned in to be upset

with me, I would just take the path of least resistance.

And so in this case with my mom, I just wasn't in

the mood. I didn't have the energy to deal with

her insistence on the past, she felt it was best for

me. So I ended up taking this job, regretted it

within the first two or three months of really

starting with them. And you know, she also

had a girl lined up and tried to push me

toward her. And so

Oh, really? So she lined up your job

and your girlfriend is that

Yeah, absolutely. Right.

This is how this is how they want to rescue

us, right? Because it's like, well, if life isn't going,

Just culturally, is this pretty common in Asian

American experience? I'm just asking.

Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, parents are always

going to be your parents, right? And so the

ones who understand hey, like, it's not

typical for parents to just say, Okay, you're 18.

Stand on your two feet. Good luck, right?

They don't do that. It's like, they want to

take care of you, but it's like, there's strings

attached pretty much on everything that

they give you. And so, yeah, you know, so

yeah, had the girl lined up had the job that

she thought I should be more grateful for

and more concerned with. And I, one point

actually was okay with job. Actually, the girl

moved on, because she just realized that I

wasn't going to move forward. And I'm

thankful that she didn't wait too long for

me to realize that this wasn't. But the job,

at one point, actually had a job that gave

me flexible scheduling and the quality of

life that I was looking for. And so I got

complacent because I knew number one,

how rare this was. So I was afraid to leave

it. Because I was like, Well, you know, in

chain pharmacy, you don't get a lot of

good pharmacy jobs that would be long

term. So I better hang on to this and make

the most of this. Wish I made sleep, I mainly

did, I was living at home. I used the money,

I didn't have to pay rent. So I just use the money

on trips and things like that. That was nice for a

while. But when that went away, when I

transferred stores, I was unhappy again,

because I didn't have the flexibility in scheduling

to do what I wanted. And so after a customer

service incident that just really left me reeling.

I did my best to put out the fire with someone

who's very upset, you know, ran out of nice

things to say. And then even worse, my

partner gives me the stink eye because

she felt like I didn't handle it nearly as

professionally as she thought it could have.

And I just said, oh my goodness, I have to

do something else. Like I have to get out

of this job. Like it didn't matter. They just

earned a third week of vacation. I just

needed to get out. And so I wanted to get

into teaching pharmacy students but

didn't have a PhD, didn't have a

residency for a conventional academic job.

But a friend of mine who work for a

consulting company here in Houston,

pharmacy consulting company said, hey,

my previous teaching position is open

says I got promoted. Would you like to

apply for it? I said, Absolutely. So now

I am interviewing for this job. I convinced

them at work taking the chance on so now

I'm leaving a full time job with benefits to

take on a part time job. You know, moving

from Tennessee, where I was living at

the time to Houston to take on this new

challenge. And of course, my mom, just

all of a sudden, she doesn't know anything

about this new company. She doesn't know

anything about living setup, anything like that.

I'm not under her watchful eye.

And so you're moving away from home as well.

Exactly. Yeah, like now I'm now I'm a plane

flight away, right. And so, initially, I thought

okay, right in my short sightedness, oh, just

get into college. Okay, just get into pharmacy

school. Okay, just get another job, right. And

initially, the first couple of months were great.

Novelty was there I was more excited, I felt

more alive in my job. But 11 months later, I got fired.

And that was like, was really tough for me. It was

one of the best things that ever happened to me,

but I didn't appreciate it at the time. And I'll be

happy to elaborate on that later. But, you know,

What do I do with myself, right? I'm just used to

the shame of failure. I'm used to saying, Oh, my

goodness, like all my friends are gonna have all

these questions about why I lost this job with this

great company that they all envied me for so long.

And now, you know, I can't even move back home,

the job market has become much more saturated.

I can't even move home to take on my previous

position it feels. So that's when the roller coaster

continue to take some really weird turns. I ended

up at a independent pharmacy where for my

paychecks, bouts filling for crooked doctors,

so I was jeopardizing my license, and this guy was paying for it.

So you had some family stuff going on your

work related stuff, and you end up with some

financial related stuff if your paychecks were

bouncing. Yeah, that's right. And several

things were happening here.

Yeah. And what do I do with this conflict?

Right. And the other wrinkle it talks about

conflict aversion and just how toxic it is right?

I didn't even have a local bank account,

like I just was mailing checks home. And so

when the first check bounced, you know, my

boss actually called me and told me Hey,

sorry about this something happened. But

we'll make it up. And I said, Okay, that's fine.

You know, things happen fine once. Sure.

Then the second, third and fourth checks

bounced, but I had no idea because I was

mailing him home. And my mom was too

afraid to tell me that this was happening. And

it's like, Mom, this is not good, right? I'm

tithing, right with money. I don't actually

have right, this is a problem. And I don't

know that I don't have this unless you tell

me bad news. Right? Yeah. You can't be

scared to say things.

Protecting you from yourself, so to speak, right?

In a way, yeah. And so, you know that was

the wake up call, just hey, you know, there's

some pretty harsh people out there. Not

everybody is harsh, but you got to look out

for the ones you have to have some better

warning signs, right. So in my misguided view

of Grace, I'm just like, well, you know, I'm

going to honor my part, even if he doesn't.

And everyone's telling me, you need to leave.

You can't even pay your bills, unless he pays you.

So after nine months of that unproductive cycle,

my friends, get me on with another company,

that's more legit. But money is tight, and they

can't pay me more than eight hours a week.

So I moved out to Austin to get more hours

at another store. And you know, this is two

and a half hours away from Houston, it

could end up in worse places. But, you know,

it just wasn't home. And I had no idea what

my life was, like at this point. And so that

summer was key, because some friends of

mine who run a pharmacy leadership

nonprofit, said, Hey, we have a facilitative

position that opened up. And we know

you've been facilitating workshops on the

fraternity side, but would you like to step in

for leadership teaching role? Absolutely.

And so teaching leadership kind of helped

me change my thinking around leadership,

because before I just said, wow, leadership

is hard and haven't been good at it. So I

don't know if I'll ever be good at it. And

just this very pessimistic view. And again,

I don't want to

so your friends help you make a shift

then to teaching as a pivot point from

being working at the store, just kind of

just a regular pharmacist dispensing

pharmaceutical goods, I assume, and

then to now teaching leadership.

This was yeah, that was that was a plant.

Yeah, this is the seeds were planted, like

I still needed pharmacy work, because

you know, that was was immediately

available to, you know, teaching leadership.

Yeah, gave me the confidence to start asking

myself, well, what if I could be a good leader?

You know what, I love that possibility. And you

know, how I carry myself, I'll work with that

involved. So when a full time position in

Houston opened up later that fall, I said,

I'm not going to stay scared. I can't afford

to miss this opportunity. So I want to come home.

Let me do let me do this. Yeah, proceed to get

written up the following year, because I had

problematic technicians, I was not disciplining

or firing. And so management says, Okay, that

is a problem. And you're passivity is also a

problem. And so as I'm in the middle of my

probationary period, the company has their

funding pulled. And so I'm just wondering,

well, what do I do next?

That does mean your teaching position

went away as well?

Well, the consulting job was already

gone for a while. The teaching seminar

was just for the summer. It wasn't a full time job. So

okay.

Yeah, but it was a good opportunity,

because that's what planted the seed

to save my pharmacy career. Because

the only reason I had pharmacy jobs after

that was that I took on more positions that

involve leadership. And so the jobs were

more plentiful, but they also were temporary.

The business models weren't sustainable for

the jobs that I was landing. And so after my

previous job went under four years ago, I said,

Well, you know, I'm tired of chasing scripts

and tired of fighting insurance companies

for reimbursements. But I love teaching

leadership workshops, you know, which

I consistently done every other summer

since the first time. And I said, What if I

had a career in coaching? What if I had

career facilitating workshops like this?

Because I know how much I loved

That led you eventually to creating

your company adaptingleaders.com,

which is leadership training and coaching?

Is that correct?

Basically, yeah, it took a while because I

I was still so afraid of failure and rejection.

And you know, when the pandemic hit, so

I tell people, it's like a pandemic for me to

wake up and say, Okay, how much longer can I put this off?

Yeah.

And so yeah, it's still try circle fail.

So you've heard these, what I'm trying

to get at here with your, you've had

these crisis moments. You've had crisis

moments in your family.

Yes.

Whether you may have even

acknowledged him as crises at

the time but they were you in

crisis moments in your career.

You have crisis moments in your finances.

Your pivotal or crisis moments in your

living arrangements. You moving here to

there, and then, but the big crisis, that

kind of major changes sound like was

the pandemic and that's kind of been

a pivotal point for you. So let's talk about

some of the pivotal points to cause you

then to do something about it. You had

these pain all along, but you did something

about it. So what are some of the actions

that you took and maybe you advocate

others take to begin to, you know, do

something about to resolve these conflicts

that you had? What are you gonna do

about it? So what did you do about it?

And maybe what are some of the lists

some transferable principles?

Yeah, great question. My problems are not new.

They are unique to me and yet they are not new, right?

There's people that are a little further along in the

leadership path that have probably seen the problem.

So that dealt with. And so the first thing is

just to ask for help, right? Whether you find

the book on Amazon, like the four conversations,

which helps with dealing with conflicts and

broken expectations in organizations, that

was a book that a friend had pointed out

to me, in terms of, you know, what are

some resources out there? Right. And

so when you're able to study success, that

you haven't been able to picture for

yourself? And you say, Okay, how did they

do it? Right? That was one step. Right? The

first is just to go out there and learn

something from either a book or a person

you respect, right, that has experienced that

you're looking for? Yes. And then the second,

though, is to put yourself in situations where

you have no choice but to apply these principles.

And because you could do it one of two ways.

One is just to ask your friends to hold you

accountable. Hey, you know, I'm about

to take on this challenge. Can you be sure

I actually follow through with what I'm

going to do? You know, that's helpful.

But I'll give one situation quick where,

you know, yeah, I had no choice but to

gauge. At one point, I served as a church

class director at a church I was going to

here in Houston. And my second day, as

Director, I find out that a newer guy

in the class was sexually harassing

women in the class. And they tell

me, Hey, Jerry, you're director, you

got to handle it. It's like, he didn't

give me a manual. They're just like,

just handle it. Just figure it out. It's like,

okay, well, I gotta run toward the gunfire.

And so when I, when I know that

avoidance is unacceptable, in this

case, you know, if I didn't do anything,

he was probably just gonna keep doing

what he's doing. Right? Because no one's

calling him out on it. So yeah, the second

is just kind of take on challenges like this.

And whether it's at work or personal take

on challenges where you realize, hey, this

is we're gonna work on.

Sometimes I've heard that phrase.

And you may forget the how the story

goes, but about the explorers who

came to America and the Explorer,

burned the ships behind him. So that

the, they couldn't get back to Europe

or whatever, you know, brass ships,

because you hadn't had to deal with

the situation at hand. So good. But good.

Go on, please. So you, you asked for help. You put

yourself in these. You had no choice but to

deal with the conflict. See, like, there's one

more thing you at least want to say about that?

Yeah, yeah, sure. I mean, the key is afterward, right?

It's one thing to just charge ahead. It's another to

like you didn't even did you even evaluate the situation?

Right? Because if you didn't, right, like, how much

value is that to you? Right, John Maxwell?

The grandfather of all leadership gurus, right.

He said, you know, experience is not enough

evaluating experience is, you know, is the key

to really growing right, Hey, what did I take

away from this? You know, when I dealt

with this guy, you know, what did I?

How would I change my approach

afterward? Right? How would I adjust things,

That's awesome. So now you've got some

tools to work with. You got some tools to

work with and conflict resolution, you know,

ask for help learn, gather information, and

you apply it by putting yourself into those

positions. Or sometimes we find ourselves

in those positions, once we have become

aware, but this we've stopped the avoidance

of yes situations in order to deal with the

present pain upfront, rather than to have

some benefit on the back end, and then

evaluate in order to do something about it.

And so that's what I like to think about top

is how we need to kind of physically, in a

way, change our posture on how we deal

with adversity. And that's part of what

we're about here. And a lot of people have

had that the last year or two with the pandemic

has forced people to change their posture, their

pivot, and you do what you got to do you know,

that those that those those points, you know,

we've heard about the you've heard the term

the great resignation, I'm sure. People then

have found that once they changed, it was

one quite so bad. They kind of liked it, that

type of thing. Let's go to the inner life a

little bit. You touched on it just a little bit

and you said you're involved with the

church and some things like that. I'm

interested now Jerry, is any part that played

in your transformation, your personal

transformation, would you teach others

that has to do with the inner life. I'm talking

about a connection to some sensibility that's

higher than yourself and I don't really mean

your mother here that you know, I mean, like

a spiritual thing or maybe meditative thing or

just a drive to, you know, to improve self. Tell

me about any connection to the inner life

that was a part of this transformation

process for you.

Yeah, sure. Um, I think, one path that

really helped give me perspective

anyway, on what this faith life was

really about this when actually it

was a late at a later stages of burnout

while I was serving as director of this

church class. And during that phase,

where I was just discouraged, and I just

said, Well, you know, I need a shot in the

arm, you know, where do I go to kind of sit

and receive and recharge, right? And so

they happen to be a former missionary that

started the fellowship at this church

that can go into slits, like this internal

supplements. And, you know, he was

very good about asking questions about,

you know, Bible, and just, you know, what

it really means to live up faith. And so to

have his perspective, and to make me

curious, again, about what is this really

about, and then I actually went to Beirut,

with a nonprofit of Arabic Christian doctors,

and see, see these practitioners do work in

dangerous parts of the world, like damascus,

or mozal. And to see just how patient and

persistent and gentle they were, made

me realize that all the problems that I

was dealing with, as a director were not

about me, there's just a much bigger

picture, a much grander scheme at

play, when it comes to building relationships

and loving people who may not love you

back the way you'd hoped.

And hopefully, that gave you a little deeper

motivation for change, then not based on

the present. situation, you know, having a

paycheck, pleasing mom, or, you know,

getting along and, you know, all that kind

of thing, you have a little bigger motivation

and motivation greater than itself. And

I'm just wondering, I really think Jerry, that's

important part of you're gonna have true

transformation. It's got to be physical, and it

also has to be spiritual. And in our life. I also

think it also has to be cognitive with,

you know, change our actual ways

change what we think, our mindset,

how we actually do things. And I'm

talking now about new habits or new

practices or new ways of doing life that

may be different than what you were

before. It seems like before you were

in the people pleasing thing and this type

of thing. And maybe you had some things

here, what are some things you do? Maybe

you do now? Or maybe teach now, that may

be different than what you had before? What

habits practices things like this?

Yeah, yeah. This one is pretty simple.

But it's also very profound. And I'll give an example with it

after I stated, one question to ask yourself is when an

opportunity becomes up to to something like an

activity on a Saturday afternoon or something

like that, right, you ask yourself, well, what else

could I do? What else could I be doing with this

time? Right. And so I'll give a personal example,

where at one point, I was volunteering to help

out with an elementary school math competition.

And this was like, on a Saturday morning, and I

had a lot of fun doing it. Right? It was it was

meaningful, it was great. And, you know,

after the next year rolled around, and

they asked for people to volunteer again,

I had to ask myself, well, what else could

I be doing with that time? You know, and I

thought, well, I could be sleeping and you

know, recovering from sleep, you know, get sleep,

I could be reading my book, that I you know,

that it really wants to finish. And I realized

that, you know, if I had to choose between

the competition and reading a book, and

recovering and just taking it take having a

more restful morning, I realized that was

the more important thing. And so, you

know, it was tough to say no, right? To

put something I enjoy so much. But

then I realized that there's a bigger game

that are bigger fish to fry, right? There's

something more important at hand, and

just feeling good about myself or volunteering missing kids.

So you did the volunteering piece,

but you then also choose the physical

health part of your rest, and you're so

you did some things to renew self, but

a part of renewing self. Some of it was

the volunteers and that type of thing

was also so it was the renewal of self

for what you were working on there.

So that's awesome. Another aspect I

believe Jerry of personal transformation.

You know, we talk a lot about that cognitive,

the mental health side of things, is the

emotional aspect that goes to relationships.

You've mentioned a little bit about some

people gave you some books and some

things like this are pointing in a different

direction. You mentioned some mentor

type folks. Tell me a little bit about emotional

relationships. You mentioned some ones that

were a little bit problematic, you know, your

family, that kind of thing. Tell me about some

emotional relations. Have some may have

been helpful to you moving forward in terms

of his transformation, you know, friendships,

mentors, family. Be part of that the emotional

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I think 1 person

that was key in this leadership transformation

is a pharmacist named Michael Negretti. And

I will sing his praises till the day I die. Because

I, when I first co facilitated the leadership

material, he was the one I was paired up

with now already liked him, you know, I

knew him as a, you know, as a guy respected,

but to work with him up close. And to

see just how he brought out the best in me and

training me up and equipping me and giving

me the confidence to pull my weight and run

through walls for him. I asked myself right

after I worked with him, so you know, what

exactly was it about his style or his personality

that really motivated me? Well, because that

was the first time in a long time that I felt like

someone like joyfully motivated needed to

move forward and do some. It was difficult

work and yet, it was very rewarding. And

so the things that came up with after, you know,

thinking about this some more, whereas to

number one, Mike is fun to be around. He's

just a pleasant guy. He doesn't crack the

whip. He's just fun to be around. Number two,

he's fun to learn from. And you know, he's

always reading some new book, he's always

learning something interesting. And he just

wants to see, well, Michael, you know, what

are you learning now? Third, he's a relentless

worker, he sets the tone, there's no question

about how hard he works. Number four, he's

always tinkering. Like, he's always thinking,

How can this be better? How can this be

better? How can we rearrange this? You

know, what could What do you think?

Can we try with this? And then number five,

he's very collaborative. He says, hey, you

know, I reshuffled the lineup, what do you

think of this, Jerry? And then I'd say, Well, you

know, I think this and that are, you know, wow.

And I just want to keep up with what he was doing.

And so that's a relationship, it's we stopped a

friendship to this day, you know, we're both

busy with things. But every time there's an

opportunity to work with them, I never turn

it down. Because I know that I'm always going to,

I love giving and supporting to him. But also, I

know that I'm also it's a mutualistic beneficiary of the

Sound like part of what you learned from him,

from your mentor here. From your friend has

been also a part of the process now that you

choose to try to be helpful to other people,

you've got a coaching program called

adapting leaders, and among the things

you talk about, is how to deal how people

deal with a temperamental boss or a stale

friendship, or family expectations. So things

we've touched on here. So you've been

motivated to create this coaching program,

and you have some interesting insights on

your website, at adapting leaders calm.

But tell me a little bit about what motivated

you to do this coaching program? And what

are people going to find If they go to your

website and want to learn more about what

they can find there and what do you offer?

Sure, sure. So the the main benefits, right?

So I'll take a client situation. One point, a

client of mine, there was a girl at church

that he thought was attractive, you want to

ask her out? And so you know, he goes up to

her, ask for a number she gives it to him, and

then she doesn't, isn't that responsive to his

calls. And then after he does a little more

research on social media, he realizes that

she already has a boyfriend. And so it's like,

well, what's really going on here? Right?

But she's just being nice. She just didn't

want to turn it down, even though she's

already spoken for, like what's going on?

And so he's telling me all this, you know, like,

what do I do, right? I can't, I can't just sit on

this resentment. Right. So we talked about,

Hey, okay, let's script out. How do you want

this conversation to go? Right. So I asked him

this, you know, how do you want this to go?

Well, you know, I'd like an apology from her.

Like, if it's appropriate. It's like, okay, you

know, what are some openers you could

use to address the situation without

antagonizing her? Right? Let's talk about

some some phrases that you can play

around with improv off of. And so, you

know, let's and then to ask him, you know,

how do you want to set this into motion?

Can you find 10 seconds of courage to

just go up and ask her, hey, you know, can

I borrow you for a couple minutes? I need to

sort out a situation with you. You know, would

that be? Is that okay? Is now a good time? Right?

And, you know, so the call I get from him later,

saying, hey, you know, yeah, you know, I was able

to address the situation with her. She apologized

for, you know, leading me on because she just

realized that she just didn't want admit that she

was too afraid to say no, even though she

already had a boyfriend, or she was interested

in somebody else. You know, for him to say

I you know, to hear him tell me just how

grateful he was for my help. I'm so glad I did this.

Right, because you help coach to be

assertive to help rather than just stewing

about it. Yeah,

yeah. Give them clear steps. Give them the

confidence to do it. And then let them

experience the closure. And once they get

that first when they want more of it,

and do you have application to do it actually

take the action? That's awesome. That's a great,

a great story there. Well, no people go to your

website, tell me what people are going to

find there. I know you have a, a resource there

that you'd like people to be aware of. Tell us about that.

Oh, yeah. I want to give this away to

as many people as I can. Because I believe

in is valuable. Even it's helpful. Yeah, you

can download a free guide on a Framework

to Handle Difficult Conversations, whether

it's personal or professional. This will give you

five steps to increase your chances of success.

Because oftentimes, right what looks like

complacency is actually confusion, right?

A lot of people know that they need to

have a hard conversation. But if no one

gives them a plan, right? Or gives them

like some kind of lighted stairway to success, right?

You know, they could find their way there.

But it'll take a lot more time and energy.

Sure, you probably need to, but other things

on the website that are free, set up a

complimentary 30 minute call. Yeah, tell me

your situation, right gets in, share your story,

share whatever you'd like. In that 30 minutes,

I just want to add value, and, and help you

through whatever you're dealing with. Or just

check out the blog where I summarize useful

and interesting leadership books and offer

other life hacks. And that's all available for free

At your website, which is adaptingleaders.com.

So you can either go there directly, or you can

go to DrBradmiller.com. And we will have links

to website there. And you heard there was helpful

things about conflict resolution. So step by step

approach some things to be helpful to you.

And particularly if you have some of these

things that have happened in your life in the

workplace, or from Asian American culture,

which is one aspect here, and we didn't get

into some of the other stuff, you're into

ballroom dancing and salsa dancing

and things like that. And so maybe there are

some life lessons in that and how to have fun,

but you, you've got a fascinating story to tell

very helpful because people, everybody has

conflicts, everybody has conflicts, that so

many people submerge them and don't do

anything about that. And then it comes out.

Oftentimes the manifestation of conflict comes

out in other ways it could be health related or

some devastating result. We don't want that.

So helpful things to us here. His name is Dr. Jerry Fu:.

He's a pharmacist by profession, but his calling

and his energy has to do with helping folks like

you to resolve conflict in your life, and to have

a more fulfilling life in in many aspects.

So thank you, Dr. Jerry Fu, for being our guest

today on the Beyond Adversity podcast with Dr. Brad Miller.